Fans: I Can't Stand Halsin Because He's Racist To Drow!

the "each bg3 character is a subversion of their usual class traits except halsin" is one of my favorite discussions but i think halsin is also a subversion he is just harder to pick out

when he kills he feels it is out of necessity and doesnt regret it even though life is lost vs. traditional druid who feels All Life is Sacred

part of druid group and was selected as the leader but is actually too much of a free soul and doesnt actually want to stay there vs. the reclusive druid who must be convinced to trek the world

halsin being a notorious bedbreaking harlot vs. the sexless-druid who is detached from intercourse/interpersonal sexual relationships

built like he got 10 meals a day vs. the tight-bodied lithe druid

I love his character, I feel like he is a druid who worships nature by experiencing it to the fullest. Which is why he doesnt take issue with things like sex and killing. It also contextualizes why he was chosen as the leader of the druid camp but wasnt happy in the position. Halsin doesnt want to be an overseer of nature, he wants to be a participant who walks and grows and fucks as much as he can

This.

Bear: *licking paws* Halsin, you have odd companions. This one came over and wouldn't stop talking to me, but the honey he gave me is very good.

Gale: *Verrrrry carefully trying to slide away from the bear*

Concept: one of the companions chilling with Halsin in bear form just chatting about nonsense

then Halsin walks over

i didn't have "i'm broken" teenage asexual angst i had "i'm literally being the only reasonable one about this concept and the rest of you are behaving like fucking freaks" perception issues

No offense meant to the Durge background, I'm sure it's compelling, but I'd like to play a protagonist where necrophilia isn't a canon part of their background.

'Tav is so boring compared to Durge who comes with a story' well its not my fault that you are uncreative... Tav is a blank sheet and you must fill the gaps to make them interesting which is the fun part.

Oak father preserve you.

Grab prints here.

As a Blackwallmancer, I never thought I'd see the day where he'd not end up last in a romance poll. The early days of DAI have come a long way.

Honestly the Halsin romance frustrates me so much, because he makes it so clear that he wants something more and you just… have no option to give it to him?

“You’re all that I want” he says but then you’re literally not allowed to tell him that he’s all YOU want!!! He’s so moved when you say you want to go with him to take care of the kids and help out with rehabilitating the (formerly) shadow cursed lands, but you don’t get to stay with him!!!

Like sure maybe he doesn’t want an exclusive relationship, but I think if you put together all the context clues of his unexplored trauma and loneliness, he probably doesn’t understand what he wants! And he deserves to have the opportunity to have his partner help him work through that and stand by him and offer him actual love and support, rather than just having him be the tacked on third to a relationship that functions entirely without him.

Be polyamorous with him. But by god, they could have had a scene of the THREE people in the relationship interacting, or at least allowed Halsin to feel like he was as important of a partner as your other one!!! Having him just say “I know you’re in love with someone else but I’m in love with you so I’ll accept the dregs” is pretty horrible, FROM A POLYAMOROUS PERSPECTIVE.

If they didn’t want to program in triad endings (very stupid if they were going to allow you to be polyamorous) they should at LEAST have allowed you to choose a paired ending with Halsin over a paired ending with your other partner. I want to help him take care of the goddamn kids and put down roots with him!!! Why can’t I? There’s nothing antithetical to polyamory in that. Polyamorous people can settle down with a partner they like, and Halsin expresses over and over through word and deed that he likes the player!!!

It just frustrates me that I feel like even when I say yes to him I’m still hurting him. He deserves so much more love and attention than the game allows him to have.

can I just say how heartbreaking it is that Halsin continuously doubts someone could love him? when he says "my heart does not stir lightly... but it does now" he actually has to take a moment to breathe and close his eyes. like he's scared to admit it. like once he opens his eyes, the PC will be gone. even during his romance scene, you have to encourage him that this was what you wanted and that when he goes into wildshape and back into his regular form, PC tells him "it's okay, now come here" like he's TERRIFIED of scaring the PC because he rambles and apologizes profusely.

and when you solo romance him/decide to leave with him post brain, he tells you in the epilogue:

"Yet you chose me", like he STILL can't believe pc could've picked him over ANYONE SIX MONTHS LATER. This man wants to be loved but STRUGGLES to believe it once someone actually loves him and it's so heartbreaking. He's just a gentle giant. (also thank you @autistichalsin bc you've encouraged me to start analyzing Halsin with your posts)

Liara can technically die but it requires:

A very low Galactic Readiness score

Her to be on the Beam run

So essentially, you have to screw over the entire galaxy to ensure her death if you're not choosing the Control ending (or can't because you blew up the Collecter Base).

Thing is, death shouldn't be the only way to be "free" of a character. Maintaining the dialogue options we used to have in ME1 would have gone a long way. It's also not like Liara was the only one to suffer from Railroading But Thou Must Dialogue in ME3 as we had that with Garrus as your best bud no matter what, Samara somehow is OK with a Renegade Shep instead of defaulting to violence like she promised or Jack somehow forgot that Shep can have always hated Cerberus and blew up the base as an F U.

It's that I wish Bioware had given players more choices instead of trimming them down to their preferences. I wish they had given us the option to temporarily fight with Mordin and Wrex during the Tuchanka mission. I wish we could have fought alongside with Thane on the Citadel with him on our team. I wish Bioware had put in more time and effort to care about other teammates players might have cared more about.

I wish, that a good chunk of the ME3 cutscenes weren't so heavily reliant on Liara. When I just got done with her time capsule request, I was checking emails to find out she's looking for an excuse to see Shepard immediately after. Then I find out her mother thinks Shepard only listens to Liara because they want to sleep with her (NO. NO I DON'T. THAT'S NOT FUNNY. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY NO TO LIARA?!).

Right after another, I'm getting inundated with Liara wanting special time with Shepard. You cannot skip the cabin requests with Liara if you want to speak with other teammates. You can't get additional war assets if you don't talk to Aethyta. You can't get your dog tags back if you don't invite Liara to your cabin in ME2. They have wound so much content around Liara's presence that you cannot avoid her completely.

The content is not subtle about making sure Liara is present in Shepard's life no matter what.

if u haven't read it a lot of liara's more action-oriented shift was told in the comics. the shadow broker DLC didn't quite capture how much effort she went thru to secure shep's body and how big feron's role. i personally welcome the change and while i like archeologist liara i think her ME1 characterization is so superficial. she's mostly just a fan girl. the shift is abrupt but it's nice that in ME2 she has her own thing going on outside shepard cos i believe the writers wrote her as the canon love interest in mind so her character often suffers from the fangirl disease. i think a lot of people in the fandom dislike how the game shove her to us so much. which is funny since another famous shepard ship is garrus, who's equally as pushed as liara and is just as much of a shep fan. it's just that he's a guy so he doesn't suffer sexist hate.

I haven't read/seen anything outside the games, no! I've been thinking of getting into that, but first I'd like to sort out all of my feelings wrt the main event - the games. I feel like if I got into the "peripheric" media, it could maybe influence how I view the games and i want to analyze those by themselves (i'm thinking i'll finish this playthrough + another one in which i might or might not play as mshep) and then see about everything else. Thank you for the rec, though! I knew there was extra stuff about tali and garrus but this is the first i'm hearing about liara <3

And well... let's be real, most of the squad is part of the Shepard fan club, even those that can't be romanced, like Grunt and Wrex. The fact that Shepard gets a breeding request in Tuchanka after completing grunt's loyalty mission is like the most Mary Sue thing ever (and I don't necessarily mean this in a bad way). The asari, sex symbols of the galaxy, are throwing themselves at them left and right (Liara, Shiala, arguably Sha'ira, Morinth...). Shepard is the main character, everyone wants a piece of them. It's one of the entertaining parts of the games (or at least I have a lot of fun with it, if maybe a little bit ironically).

I suppose people might single out Liara because she's the one whose actions are the most extreme, and thus it crosses the line from "cute" to "creepy", but she's not the only one. Legion literally wears the armor off their dead body. As I said in my post, maybe her actions and/or attitude aren't 100% justifiable, but they are understandable.

I'm not sure about the game pushing Garrus as a love interest (I think the game itself is skeptical of the player making this choice, like when Shepard says she "can't believe she finds comfort in the arms of a turian" or something like that), but I do think he's definitely meant to be one of the characters that's most influenced by Shepard, regardless of gender.

Personally, I think him being so popular a choice (at least on Tumblr, which has a mostly female userbase compared to other social media) is due to him being a man, yes, but not necessarily because of sexism (or not always), but because het ships are farrrr more popular than femslash. Also, it's very clear how much he respects Shepard in basically every aspect, and it's incredibly fucking rare to see a het relationship in such equal ground, especially with a """bad guy""" lmao. (though ME in general does quite good in that regard I think, the romances in general are not toxic™️ or unequal) (mostly... ignoring that Shepard is basically everyone's boss... lol).

I completely agree that there's a double standard in how female characters are expected to behave vs male ones, and from what i've seen Liara is 100% a victim of this (I had the very bad idea of reading some threads on reddit...yikes). I don't know the fandom enough to know how it compares in relation to Garrus in particular, though, or if there's a correlation between Shakarian fans and Liara haters.